[Runamuck]

Originally Posted by test54

Erik - it shows on the video using both thumbs similar to BB style so i dont think it will be that slow.

Back when the iPaq Win CE/Pocket PC devices first arrived, there was a software add-in that would let you convert the entire screen in landscape mode to a QWERTY keyboard with a text-entry box at the top. It worked pretty well...I typed many emails that way offline. The fact that the screen (back then) wasn't multi-touch was a bit of a drag as my fingers would go faster than the app could keep up, but I had a spell checker app that fixed that for me.

What I couldn't do then, and I doubt iPhone users will be able to do now, was easily type on the beasty while I held it in my hands. It was too hard to keep a firm grip on the device while I typed, so I tended to hunt-and-peck with one hand more often than not, or lie the unit on it's back flat to use the on-screen keyboard. Given how thin the iPhone is (thinner than the 8800 from the specs I've seen), that's going to be a bit of an issue when used in LANDSCAPE mode.

But portrait mode thumb-typing....the dimensions of the screen-keys aren't much different than my 8800....I think it'll be doable.

[test54]

tifosiv122, do you have more than one story to back up your bad input story? I know there was one on engadget citing an unknown source - 1 person. But really, until tomorrow we dont know if the touchscreen works well or not. I agree with runamauck that its not that small compared to the 88xx series and i will go to one of the stores to try it out for myself rather than trust any of the rumor sites as they are becoming more and more unreliable.

Apple - iPhone - iPhone keyboard video on the keyboard, good walkthrough

And I know several people in my company that use tablet pc's everyday and have no problem typing with them. But im sure as with the 88xx their will be a outcry of people complaining that its tough to type on, but as with those if people actually give themselves the time to adjust it will result if good speeds and accuracy.

Raven, why does it need a removable battery? I know that there's an issue if the battery goes bad but it not like BB where you need to do a battery pull to reboot so i think the issue is actually if the battery is defective then it requires either sending it in or in store replacement, not sure how they will handle that.

atuarre, you have made your point for now - i'm sure that they will address that as all major pda's have messaging certainly they did not just forget about it.

I'm done trying to say that the device is NOT perfect, my only point is that no device is perfect.

Nytimes Pulpbite: Pogue's iPhone Video Review - Gizmodo

[eddieb]

Originally Posted by benway

I think no removable/replaceable battery, and no 3g for the iphone are a terrible mistake

ive seen the tv ad where they have the new york times front page online, but they dont show how long the page takes to load, and they dont click on any links-- they just zoom in and out on the same page,

i think people expect the internet on the iphone will be broadband fast and theyre going to be surprised/disappointed to find it more like dial up

I agree. The AT&T network edge is VERY slow. People are gonna be upset at the "speed". One of the reviews said it took 2 minutes to load either Amazon or Yahoo - can't remember which. That's a looooong time! If the iPhone was on Verizon and used EVDO, I'd probably be all over it. I'm still considering it, but the AT&T thing may be the deal breaker.

[greggebhardt]

The iPhone has NO keyboard!

For those who do alot of email, a piece of plastic is not a keyboard. A keyboard is something you can feel and has tactile feedback. I have a tablet PC and the huge QWERTY keyboard ont eh screen is horrible, I can not even imagine how bad the tiny iPhone screen is to use.

I think this will be attractive to the sidekick users, maybe

[davistld01]

I am a very simple person, and tend to be very black & white about things...

I don't see why we are comparing the BlackBerry 8800, 8300...or whatever model, to the Apple iPhone. They are two completely different devices aimed at completely different niches of people with completely different needs and preferences. I am not a corporate user (inasmuch as my company doesn't pay for my phones...or my plan) so the reason I use a BlackBerry as a personal "manager" device is because it is a great combination of a mobile phone, email source, and daily organizer. Other smartphone/PDA devices can do this too...but to me, none do it as effectively as BlackBerry. I personally don't give a flying rip about having a music player, video player, or (for the most part) high-speed web browser, on a phone. Once again...I have little gripe about the BlackBerry. It does what it does very well...

The iPhone is trying to be everything to everybody. It is 100% aimed at a tech-hungry public that wants everything but the kitchen sink in a mobile device...and wants the "next big thing"...at the expense of a device that is a media performer first and foremost, and a business/personal-management tool a distant second. That's ok for a lot of people...just not for me. They will sell tons of 'em...there is no doubt. But, I predict that AT&T will see tons of returns as well...when people "come out of the ether".

[zero7404]

ok kids, let's simmer down....no need for any1 to loose their cool over a worthless debate.

iphone, imo, will simply not make it to the top because there are no dedicated hardware keys on it. it looks like all interaction takes place on-screen. if this is the case, and your finger is too large to select a small item on the screen, then how do you dial out when your driving ? how do you dial voicemail ? on a BB or any other mobile phone, u hold down the 1 key. on the iphone you'd have to hit 2 or 3 icons or progress thru some screens ? if the best way to use it is with a stylus or pointer, that might be a problem for some.

how do you swap out a sim card on the iphone ? is it even swappable ?
if it is not (just like ipod batteries cannot be removed without disassembly), then there will be alot of ppl yelling about it after they pay $ 600 for this ipod/phone.

[zero7404]

Originally Posted by davistld01

Once again...I have little gripe about the BlackBerry. It does what it does very well...

well said

Originally Posted by davistld01

The iPhone is trying to be everything to everybody. It is 100% aimed at a tech-hungry public that wants everything but the kitchen sink in a mobile device...and wants the "next big thing"...at the expense of a device that is a media performer first and foremost, and a business/personal-management tool a distant second. That's ok for a lot of people...just not for me. They will sell tons of 'em...there is no doubt. But, I predict that AT&T will see tons of returns as well...when people "come out of the ether".

well said, again

[zero7404]

here's a blog i found on yahoo that's interesting....

Why I'm Not Getting an iPhone : Gina Hughes : Yahoo! Tech

[test54]

i'm done posting any explanations of the pros and cons on the device. this is a bb site and i know that we think the bb is the best device for us and all but a little bit of perspective might be in order. for me, im open to trying it out before passing final judgement, call me an optimist.

[Dawgfan]

Originally Posted by atuarre

From what I have heard, the Iphone will not have instant messaging capabilities, and I think amongst these younger generations (aka the burger king kiddes, as someone referred to them earlier) that will be one of the biggest killers.

This isn't just going to affect Burger King Kiddies. I am twice their age and LOVE Jive Talk and if I go to the iPhone can only hope BeeJive does something for it...

[Dawgfan]

I have been pondering this question for a few weeks now. My gf has offered to buy me an iPhone but I have been wondering if I can give up my 8800 for it.

I keep hearing there will be push emal via Yahoo or whoever but I have yet to see someone match the BB's email. I will need an IM client like Jive Talk as well.

I think what blew me away was that the talk time is double the Curve and almost double my 8800. I was not expecting that. Thing is, almost everyday I take a lunch and drag my BB and my 80GB iPod with me. I watch a video or listen to a podcast.

I love my 8800 and will slightly miss the GPS but I think it is a done deal for me. I will be giving the iPhone a shot. I admit the 8800 will be kept nearby for a few weeks just in case (further evidence of Crackberry).

If I had to spend the $600 I might not do it but since the woman has offered to buy me one with part of her bonus (we have a tradition of doing this with bonuses) it is hard to turn down. Over time with a nice RSS reader, IM client and maybe a few other novelties, I think I will be pretty happy with the iPhone.

I just realized I would no longer be relative to this site.. that is kinda sad as this place is awesome. I guess I can come here with questions for my gf's BB!!

[Alex Alexzander]

Originally Posted by Dawgfan

I have been pondering this question for a few weeks now. My gf has offered to buy me an iPhone but I have been wondering if I can give up my 8800 for it.

I keep hearing there will be push emal via Yahoo or whoever but I have yet to see someone match the BB's email. I will need an IM client like Jive Talk as well.

I think what blew me away was that the talk time is double the Curve and almost double my 8800. I was not expecting that. Thing is, almost everyday I take a lunch and drag my BB and my 80GB iPod with me. I watch a video or listen to a podcast.

I love my 8800 and will slightly miss the GPS but I think it is a done deal for me. I will be giving the iPhone a shot. I admit the 8800 will be kept nearby for a few weeks just in case (further evidence of Crackberry).

If I had to spend the $600 I might not do it but since the woman has offered to buy me one with part of her bonus (we have a tradition of doing this with bonuses) it is hard to turn down. Over time with a nice RSS reader, IM client and maybe a few other novelties, I think I will be pretty happy with the iPhone.

I just realized I would no longer be relative to this site.. that is kinda sad as this place is awesome. I guess I can come here with questions for my gf's BB!!

If you can find a copy of yesterday's edition of the Wall Street Journal, there is a good write up of the phone in it. I got stuck at JFK last night. A lot of flights were canceled. Luckily mine was not, but I didn't even board till after midnight, and didn't get home until 5:30AM, which includes the time change. Including my flight time, I was stuck in the airport for over 24 hours straight. While there, I did read that article by Walt Mossberg. I saw the price plans, and truth be told, if it had more of the features I need, I would consider it.

At this time, I think it has more than a few issues. First one is that you have to go through something like 6 steps to be able to bang out a phone call. That's not acceptable to me. On the bb, just start typing a name or a number and out the options pop up. Next, no copy and paste on iPhone. Just yesterday, I emailed my warehouse while having lunch at the airport. I got our Fedex account number. copy and paste that into a new email to a supplier. I do little things like that all the time. No such ability in iPhone.

iPhone can view a word doc, but can't save it. That's lame. I have to be able to view a document, save it, and send it later on. No question, the lack of that feature right there is a deal killer.

While in New York, I went to a meeting to show off a product we developed. I had samples fedexed to me at the Welington hotel in New York. I don't want to lug these samples back home with me. I go to my BB, use telenav Biz Finder to locate two Fedex Kinko locations. I save those locations to favorites, and then later on, when I was being taken to the airport, I just ask the phone to tell me how to get to that fedex location from where I am now. I show that to my driver, and I drop off the samples to fedex on my way to the airport.

These are common things I do often, and the iPhone, as nice as it is, lacks all of this. I'm with you in that it is a great looking device. It looks awesome, and new, and who wouldn't want one. But the features are just not there.

Who knows though. Maybe in a year or two, it could mature. For now, the BB is still a better choice from my point of view.

-Alex

[jewberry]

Originally Posted by Alex Alexzander

If you can find a copy of yesterday's edition of the Wall Street Journal, there is a good write up of the phone in it. I got stuck at JFK last night. A lot of flights were canceled. Luckily mine was not, but I didn't even board till after midnight, and didn't get home until 5:30AM, which includes the time change. Including my flight time, I was stuck in the airport for over 24 hours straight. While there, I did read that article by Walt Mossberg. I saw the price plans, and truth be told, if it had more of the features I need, I would consider it.

At this time, I think it has more than a few issues. First one is that you have to go through something like 6 steps to be able to bang out a phone call. That's not acceptable to me. On the bb, just start typing a name or a number and out the options pop up. Next, no copy and paste on iPhone. Just yesterday, I emailed my warehouse while having lunch at the airport. I got our Fedex account number. copy and paste that into a new email to a supplier. I do little things like that all the time. No such ability in iPhone.

iPhone can view a word doc, but can't save it. That's lame. I have to be able to view a document, save it, and send it later on. No question, the lack of that feature right there is a deal killer.

While in New York, I went to a meeting to show off a product we developed. I had samples fedexed to me at the Welington hotel in New York. I don't want to lug these samples back home with me. I go to my BB, use telenav Biz Finder to locate two Fedex Kinko locations. I save those locations to favorites, and then later on, when I was being taken to the airport, I just ask the phone to tell me how to get to that fedex location from where I am now. I show that to my driver, and I drop off the samples to fedex on my way to the airport.

These are common things I do often, and the iPhone, as nice as it is, lacks all of this. I'm with you in that it is a great looking device. It looks awesome, and new, and who wouldn't want one. But the features are just not there.

Who knows though. Maybe in a year or two, it could mature. For now, the BB is still a better choice from my point of view.

-Alex

Great analysis Alex. However, most of your criticisms can be easily rectified by anyone with a laptop. I'm sure you carry a laptop with you on your travels.

[test54]

good point jewberry but i think he wants to see some of them handled on the phone so he doesnt need to carry it. I agree with alex that some additional programs need to be added and i feel that they will be added as soon as apple works out the bugs in them. ichat will be the likely chat client i think and i would not be surprised to see google docs and spreadsheets added in some form. btw - it does have google maps built in but of course no gps.

dawfan im with you about having the podcasts with me, i try to do it with my 8800 but its not easy. (smodcast, diggnation & twit)

now can we get a jewberry & alex fight going again...

[jewberry]

Originally Posted by test54

good point jewberry but i think he wants to see some of them handled on the phone so he doesnt need to carry it. I agree with alex that some additional programs need to be added and i feel that they will be added as soon as apple works out the bugs in them. ichat will be the likely chat client i think and i would not be surprised to see google docs and spreadsheets added in some form. btw - it does have google maps built in but of course no gps.

dawfan im with you about having the podcasts with me, i try to do it with my 8800 but its not easy. (smodcast, diggnation & twit)

now can we get a jewberry & alex fight going again...

no fight intended- I'm just a novice/amateur techie looking for some thrills.

iChat could spawn the 1st gen of REAL video phoning. That would be cool.

BTW, big rumors circulating that GOOG will make a run at AAPL. we'll see.

[test54]

i dont think apple would do that but you never know. But they are getting cozier as time goes on, and can see their internet apps becoming very apple friendly. would they have jobs in charge of google and apple products, then he also has a large role in Disney now too. I dont see it as Apple doesnt have enough to gain other than alot of cash.

Ichat has alot of capability that has never been really used on the macs (because they started it off as almost an aim client) but it has the video capability but apple has two hurdles - one the camera would need to be on the same side as the screen and two would be that as of yet they dont have the camera enable to capture video. But i think the software update will be very busy over the next 6 months.

btw actually it was teamcrn vs. alex, sorry jewberry.

[teamcrn]

Steve jobs is a majority owner and has a seat on the board @ disney. This all came about from the pixar sale. Apple is jobs bran Child i dont see apple selling. What would they gain? there stock is allready at a premium and jobs has been rich for years 2 and 3 times over.

[Galvatron]

this pretty much sums up a good chunk
FOXNews.com - So Should You Get an iPhone, or What? - Technology News | News On Technology

and here too
Devil's Advocate View of iPhone | Video | Reuters.com

[netwiz01]

Originally Posted by greggebhardt

The iPhone has NO keyboard!

For those who do alot of email, a piece of plastic is not a keyboard. A keyboard is something you can feel and has tactile feedback. I have a tablet PC and the huge QWERTY keyboard ont eh screen is horrible, I can not even imagine how bad the tiny iPhone screen is to use.

I think this will be attractive to the sidekick users, maybe

Its amazing that no commercials demonstract SMS or email fucntionality of the iPhone, but then again I understand why.

[Alex Alexzander]

Originally Posted by jewberry

Great analysis Alex. However, most of your criticisms can be easily rectified by anyone with a laptop. I'm sure you carry a laptop with you on your travels.

Sorry, as I got in at 5:30AM, I actually just woke up a short time ago. Little sleep for the last 4 days.

I actually do not carry a laptop when I travel if I don't have to. That is why I bought the BB. I found that it had enough features that I could use it for about 3 or 4 days without the need for a laptop.

Although on this trip, a laptop could have helped me as I also do quick design work, and could have used Aobe CS3 with me on the trip. But the list of uses I got from the BB is typical of my kind of uses. There are those that buy a phone because it is cool. I bought the BB because I wanted to replace my laptop as much as possible. At the Wellington for example, they claim to have WiFi for $9.99 a night. The signal there is so weak, it doesn't even connect or work. I traveled with another person who did rely on a laptop, and he couldn't get it to work at all. At the breakfast shop, it did work, barely, and he was able to finally get a few emails. At the Airport, with so many flights canceled, and so many people sitting on the floor last night at JFK waiting out the lightning storm, the WiFi was so stressed again, he couldn't use the laptop successfully.

So from my point of view, I am sitting there with a newspaper. Good old printed paper. I have that to read. I have excellent email push to work with, and I am in contact with everyone, personal and corporate without delay. And it's quite nice to be sitting at an airport restaurant with merely a phone vibrating to tell me I have email, than to be hold a laptop running Outlook. Yes, laptops work, but who would want a laptop on at their table? A BB is so much better to have as you get to be a normal person who happens to be very accessible via IM, SMS, email, and voice.

These are not issues to be dismissed. If you have come to rely on these kinds of features, and then switch to an iPhone, you have to ask yourself if the cool factor is so valued that it out ranks the features that actually help you get your work done. Being able to find Kinko's from where I am currently, is priceless. I don't know New York. I don't even know where I was. But the phone does, and it knows how far away any of 4 locations of Fed ex are to me. And I can show that to my driver, and he got me there in no time. That's a fantastic feature. It all gets added to my addressbook too. Which means, should I need that information later, it's not on a postit. It's in my phone, and I can get at it later on. That's the way it should be.

Best,

Alex